These are the contact details for the French police who have already investigated Johnny Grant and Kate Marsh.
As per previous post, they raided The Art Farm after a group who had turned up for a course there demanded their money back. So they will hopefully follow up other cases.
I will be contacting them myself.
best of luck
Juliette
POLICE:
Adjutant AGULHON Philippe
Brigade de VILLENEUVE DE BERG
50 Allée de la Gendarmerie
07170 VILLENEUVE DE BERG
tél. : 04 75 94 80 01
Fax: 04 75 88 83 30
Tuesday, 29 June 2010
Wednesday, 16 June 2010
Police now involved
This message from someone who went to the art farm sent to me today:
I paid 1950 british pounds for an internship, I did go there and it turned out to be falsely advertised. They were running the internship but it was much different from what they advertised, three out of six girls pulled out the first week because they could not stand the cold and bad living conditions. 2 others and I stayed for a week but then the French police came and dissolved the whole thing. All 6 of us testified and filed a complaint for false advertising. The police said that they had some data on Johny and Kate through Interpol. Apparently somebody from Germany tried acting through the Interpol last year. They seized Kate and Johny's computers and credit cards to do research but I dont know what they found. UK police should get in touch with the French police. Later today I'll send you the names of the victims I know of and Johny's adress in France and who to contact at the police station in France.
Keep in touch!
Blanca
I paid 1950 british pounds for an internship, I did go there and it turned out to be falsely advertised. They were running the internship but it was much different from what they advertised, three out of six girls pulled out the first week because they could not stand the cold and bad living conditions. 2 others and I stayed for a week but then the French police came and dissolved the whole thing. All 6 of us testified and filed a complaint for false advertising. The police said that they had some data on Johny and Kate through Interpol. Apparently somebody from Germany tried acting through the Interpol last year. They seized Kate and Johny's computers and credit cards to do research but I dont know what they found. UK police should get in touch with the French police. Later today I'll send you the names of the victims I know of and Johny's adress in France and who to contact at the police station in France.
Keep in touch!
Blanca
Friday, 18 December 2009
And the long story of how I lost £350 to Johnny Grant and The Art Farm - for those who want the gory details
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click here to view the post.
My Johnny Grant/The Art Farm story… (the short version)
DECEMBER 2007
I ordered a bath from The Art Farm via an Ebay ‘Buy it Now’ posting on 26th December 2007, and paid £351.00 via Paypal immediately, with a further £49 due on arrival for the delivery cost.
The Art Farm promised delivery from France "around 15th February" 2008, saying that they would be in touch in good time to organise it. (Note that 15th February is – coincidentally? – just over 45 days after my purchase date, and hence outside the Paypal complaints procedure timefame.)
FEBRUARY 2008
But by 15th February I had not heard anything further from them about delivery.
After I contacted them, the Art Farm said they had van problems, hence the delivery delay. I said I was happy to wait a week or two; they then on 21st February gave me a date they were 'hoping to deliver' nearly five weeks later, on 20th March – and offered me a refund if that did not suit.
The date was too late for my builders, and at substantial extra cost to me I had to order a new bath. I accepted their offer of a refund.
MARCH 2008
However, no refund was forthcoming… over the subsequent ten weeks they repeatedly promised said refund and did not give it to me – claiming they didn’t have the money (although they sold another bath on Ebay during this time).
I offered to take the bath instead, despite that fact that I no longer needed it. They never replied to this offer.
APRIL 2008
I told them that I would reluctantly have to give them bad feedback if they did not refund me the money, as there was a cut off date for feedback and after that I would no longer be able to leave it. I offered to withdraw the feedback within the month (Ebay's deadline for feedback withdrawl) if they gave me either a refund or the bath I had paid for in that timeframe. Again, they did not refund me the money, and sent me a pretty nasty email complaining about my negative feedback after I had left it. They told me they would refund the money “when better times are with us at the Art Farm. It is a non profit association that gives more than it recieves (sic)”. Two years later in December 2009 – I’m still waiting. And because he’s in France, there’s limited recourse to the law.
DECEMBER 2009
Since my experiences, more stories have emerged of money taken and goods undelivered… if you want the blow-by-blow account of my story, I’ll be posting the chronological emails shortly. In the meantime: just don’t follow in my footsteps and have anything to do with Johnny Grant – or The Art Farm.
Rachel
I ordered a bath from The Art Farm via an Ebay ‘Buy it Now’ posting on 26th December 2007, and paid £351.00 via Paypal immediately, with a further £49 due on arrival for the delivery cost.
The Art Farm promised delivery from France "around 15th February" 2008, saying that they would be in touch in good time to organise it. (Note that 15th February is – coincidentally? – just over 45 days after my purchase date, and hence outside the Paypal complaints procedure timefame.)
FEBRUARY 2008
But by 15th February I had not heard anything further from them about delivery.
After I contacted them, the Art Farm said they had van problems, hence the delivery delay. I said I was happy to wait a week or two; they then on 21st February gave me a date they were 'hoping to deliver' nearly five weeks later, on 20th March – and offered me a refund if that did not suit.
The date was too late for my builders, and at substantial extra cost to me I had to order a new bath. I accepted their offer of a refund.
MARCH 2008
However, no refund was forthcoming… over the subsequent ten weeks they repeatedly promised said refund and did not give it to me – claiming they didn’t have the money (although they sold another bath on Ebay during this time).
I offered to take the bath instead, despite that fact that I no longer needed it. They never replied to this offer.
APRIL 2008
I told them that I would reluctantly have to give them bad feedback if they did not refund me the money, as there was a cut off date for feedback and after that I would no longer be able to leave it. I offered to withdraw the feedback within the month (Ebay's deadline for feedback withdrawl) if they gave me either a refund or the bath I had paid for in that timeframe. Again, they did not refund me the money, and sent me a pretty nasty email complaining about my negative feedback after I had left it. They told me they would refund the money “when better times are with us at the Art Farm. It is a non profit association that gives more than it recieves (sic)”. Two years later in December 2009 – I’m still waiting. And because he’s in France, there’s limited recourse to the law.
DECEMBER 2009
Since my experiences, more stories have emerged of money taken and goods undelivered… if you want the blow-by-blow account of my story, I’ll be posting the chronological emails shortly. In the meantime: just don’t follow in my footsteps and have anything to do with Johnny Grant – or The Art Farm.
Rachel
Course paid for, cancelled and never refunded
Correspondence from another person who lost £500 to Johnny Grant:
Tings Chak November 26 at 9:38am
Hi there,
I'm very relieved to find someone else who has been swindled by the Art Farm. I registered for a Natural Building course for this past September... and after my payment and some very sketchy communication, they told me that the Art Farm was closed indefinitely because of a lightening storm and that my payment for the course was considered a "donation," and thus no refund. I've been battling this payment with my credit card company, with paypal, with them for several months now.
They apparently filed for bankruptcy in August. Their website remained unchanged, and they were still accepting money for products/courses they were no longer offering.
I am not sure what their current status is, but this thing seems to drag on.
Thanks for listening,
Tings
Juliette Garside November 26 at 10:51pm
So sorry you got caught out too. How much did you hand over?
Tings Chak December 1 at 10:57am
500 pounds for the course... Have you come across many other folks who have taken the fall?
Juliette Garside December 9 at 9:42pm
Hi Tings
Yes, I've come across two other people who like me paid for baths they never got...
Tings Chak November 26 at 9:38am
Hi there,
I'm very relieved to find someone else who has been swindled by the Art Farm. I registered for a Natural Building course for this past September... and after my payment and some very sketchy communication, they told me that the Art Farm was closed indefinitely because of a lightening storm and that my payment for the course was considered a "donation," and thus no refund. I've been battling this payment with my credit card company, with paypal, with them for several months now.
They apparently filed for bankruptcy in August. Their website remained unchanged, and they were still accepting money for products/courses they were no longer offering.
I am not sure what their current status is, but this thing seems to drag on.
Thanks for listening,
Tings
Juliette Garside November 26 at 10:51pm
So sorry you got caught out too. How much did you hand over?
Tings Chak December 1 at 10:57am
500 pounds for the course... Have you come across many other folks who have taken the fall?
Juliette Garside December 9 at 9:42pm
Hi Tings
Yes, I've come across two other people who like me paid for baths they never got...
Thursday, 17 December 2009
How I lost £400 to The Art Farm
If you see an ad on Ebay or Gumtree for an antique French bath, it is likely to have been placed there by a man called Johnny Grant who runs The Art Farm. He presents it as a collective for creative types but it seems to have just one member - Mr Grant.
Earlier this year I contacted him hoping to buy a bath which he would import for me from France, where The Art Farm is based.
He wanted £400 for an unrestored antique French bath. Not cheap, but competitive when spruced up ones go for £800 or more.
He told me I would need to pay upfront, as he had delivered baths to people in the past who had tried to knock down the price once the goods were delivered.
I asked what money back guarantee I had if he couldn't source a bath, and his answer was vague, but he promised me a receipt.
The money was handed over on 19th August 2009.
Here is a copy of his receipt.
He said previous customers had waited up to three months for a bath and mine could take as long. As our building work was running until Christmas, I said that wouldn't be a problem.
September came and went with no bath, and in October, after a few prompts, I received a message saying he was busy but on the case.
I replied that there was no rush, but end of November would be ideal for delivery. As the date approached, there was no word from Mr Grant. A couple of weeks before the end of November, I sent a reminder. Radio silence.
On 23 November, I wrote saying I would need the bath by the end of the month, or my money back by 3 December.
I received his answer on 24 November.
The basic gist was: The Art Farm don't do refunds. Stocks of French baths running low. Pas de delivery until the new year.
So I wrote back, threatening him with a lot of bad publicity on the internet if he did not return the money. His response arrived straight from crazyland. Basically he is a struggling artist and we all owe him a living.
I have sympathy for struggling artists. But none for dishonest cowboy traders.
Unfortunately, although I first contacted Mr Grant through his Ebay ad, I paid him directly for the bath, so no protection throught Paypal.
As he is based in France, it may not be possible to pursue him through the courts, although he also seems to have a pied-a-terre in Swindon, where he's been happy to PR his business in the local paper.
So I did what I should have done before handing over any cash, and checked out his profile on Ebay. There was a bit of feedback, but only two that looked genuine. I contacted both customers.
One had received his bath, the other, a woman like me who had paid hundreds of pounds upfront at the beginning of the year, had not. Another bathless victim of Mr Grant's has since contacted her, with the same story. Between us, we have handed over more than £1000.
The Art Farm website also advertises eco building courses. Same thing there - money up front, but no refunds if the course is 'cancelled'.
I have since been contacted by someone who handed over £500 in September for a Natural Building course which never happened.
There ARE people who have actually been on courses at The Art Farm. And what an experience that is. Here is one woman's survival story.
So sometimes Mr Grant delivers, and sometimes he doesn't. Would you hand over £500 on a fifty per cent likely hood of getting something in return? Not really good enough is it?
More next from some of the other people duped by The Art Farm...
Earlier this year I contacted him hoping to buy a bath which he would import for me from France, where The Art Farm is based.
He wanted £400 for an unrestored antique French bath. Not cheap, but competitive when spruced up ones go for £800 or more.
He told me I would need to pay upfront, as he had delivered baths to people in the past who had tried to knock down the price once the goods were delivered.
I asked what money back guarantee I had if he couldn't source a bath, and his answer was vague, but he promised me a receipt.
The money was handed over on 19th August 2009.
Here is a copy of his receipt.
He said previous customers had waited up to three months for a bath and mine could take as long. As our building work was running until Christmas, I said that wouldn't be a problem.
September came and went with no bath, and in October, after a few prompts, I received a message saying he was busy but on the case.
I replied that there was no rush, but end of November would be ideal for delivery. As the date approached, there was no word from Mr Grant. A couple of weeks before the end of November, I sent a reminder. Radio silence.
On 23 November, I wrote saying I would need the bath by the end of the month, or my money back by 3 December.
I received his answer on 24 November.
The basic gist was: The Art Farm don't do refunds. Stocks of French baths running low. Pas de delivery until the new year.
So I wrote back, threatening him with a lot of bad publicity on the internet if he did not return the money. His response arrived straight from crazyland. Basically he is a struggling artist and we all owe him a living.
I have sympathy for struggling artists. But none for dishonest cowboy traders.
Unfortunately, although I first contacted Mr Grant through his Ebay ad, I paid him directly for the bath, so no protection throught Paypal.
As he is based in France, it may not be possible to pursue him through the courts, although he also seems to have a pied-a-terre in Swindon, where he's been happy to PR his business in the local paper.
So I did what I should have done before handing over any cash, and checked out his profile on Ebay. There was a bit of feedback, but only two that looked genuine. I contacted both customers.
One had received his bath, the other, a woman like me who had paid hundreds of pounds upfront at the beginning of the year, had not. Another bathless victim of Mr Grant's has since contacted her, with the same story. Between us, we have handed over more than £1000.
The Art Farm website also advertises eco building courses. Same thing there - money up front, but no refunds if the course is 'cancelled'.
I have since been contacted by someone who handed over £500 in September for a Natural Building course which never happened.
There ARE people who have actually been on courses at The Art Farm. And what an experience that is. Here is one woman's survival story.
So sometimes Mr Grant delivers, and sometimes he doesn't. Would you hand over £500 on a fifty per cent likely hood of getting something in return? Not really good enough is it?
More next from some of the other people duped by The Art Farm...
no refund
From: "The Art Farm"
Date: 24 November 2009 04:23:01 GMT
To:
Subject: RE: (no subject)
To Juliette,
Thank you for selecting The Art Farm for your antique bath tub purchase. I am writing with the unfortunate news that our stock has unexpectedly depleted for the year and we are currently unable to find more stock in France. This has been very surprising to us because in past years this time of year has been very successful for the purchase of antiques.
Please understand that I have been unable to answer emails recently as I have been on the road looking for bath tubs. Your order will still be fulfille, however all deliveries are now on hold until 2010 due to forth coming snow in the area and unavailable stock.
We sincerely apologize for this inconvenience and hope that our services can still be useful to you with a delayed delivery.
The Art Farm terms and conditions state that we are obliged to hold all order until we redeem our stock. We will keep you informed as to the expected delivery dates for 2010. I do understand the inconvenience that this may cause and have tried my best to complete the orders, there are simply no tubs available and deliveries from France are not possible in this weather.
Regards,
Johnny Grant
-----Original Message-----
From: juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk [mailto:juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk]
Sent: Tuesday, 24 November 2009 1:15 AM
To: info@theartfarm.info
Cc: juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk
Subject: (no subject)
Dear Mr Grant
At the end of August I transferred £400 to you as advance payment in full for a bath tub which you were intending to source for me in France.
You confirmed receipt of this amount on 28th August, saying that you hoped to have the bath by end of September. When it did not arrive, I subsequently wrote to say we could wait until the end of November.
It is now one week before the end of November and I have received neither the bath nor any word from you about when it might arrive.
I emailed you on 16th November to remind you that I would need the bath within a couple of weeks. This is because I am renovating my home and have a plumber on standby now to install the bath.
This email of 16th November received no reply.
I am now doubtful you will be able to meet the end of November deadline, and your lack of communication is very concerning.
Therefore:
Please could you either deliver the bath to my home in London, after I have seen photos of it and agreed that it is suitable, as per our agreement, by November 30th.
If for whatever reason you are unable to do this, please refund the £400.00 by Thursday 3 December. I cannot send you my account details. Instead, I would ask you to pay the money via paypal's money transfer service. You would need to quote this email address, juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk.
Yours sincerely
Juliette Garside
tel: xxxx
Date: 24 November 2009 04:23:01 GMT
To:
Subject: RE: (no subject)
To Juliette,
Thank you for selecting The Art Farm for your antique bath tub purchase. I am writing with the unfortunate news that our stock has unexpectedly depleted for the year and we are currently unable to find more stock in France. This has been very surprising to us because in past years this time of year has been very successful for the purchase of antiques.
Please understand that I have been unable to answer emails recently as I have been on the road looking for bath tubs. Your order will still be fulfille, however all deliveries are now on hold until 2010 due to forth coming snow in the area and unavailable stock.
We sincerely apologize for this inconvenience and hope that our services can still be useful to you with a delayed delivery.
The Art Farm terms and conditions state that we are obliged to hold all order until we redeem our stock. We will keep you informed as to the expected delivery dates for 2010. I do understand the inconvenience that this may cause and have tried my best to complete the orders, there are simply no tubs available and deliveries from France are not possible in this weather.
Regards,
Johnny Grant
-----Original Message-----
From: juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk [mailto:juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk]
Sent: Tuesday, 24 November 2009 1:15 AM
To: info@theartfarm.info
Cc: juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk
Subject: (no subject)
Dear Mr Grant
At the end of August I transferred £400 to you as advance payment in full for a bath tub which you were intending to source for me in France.
You confirmed receipt of this amount on 28th August, saying that you hoped to have the bath by end of September. When it did not arrive, I subsequently wrote to say we could wait until the end of November.
It is now one week before the end of November and I have received neither the bath nor any word from you about when it might arrive.
I emailed you on 16th November to remind you that I would need the bath within a couple of weeks. This is because I am renovating my home and have a plumber on standby now to install the bath.
This email of 16th November received no reply.
I am now doubtful you will be able to meet the end of November deadline, and your lack of communication is very concerning.
Therefore:
Please could you either deliver the bath to my home in London, after I have seen photos of it and agreed that it is suitable, as per our agreement, by November 30th.
If for whatever reason you are unable to do this, please refund the £400.00 by Thursday 3 December. I cannot send you my account details. Instead, I would ask you to pay the money via paypal's money transfer service. You would need to quote this email address, juliette.garside@xxxx.co.uk.
Yours sincerely
Juliette Garside
tel: xxxx
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